Why Monday’s King’s Lynn incinerator vote is hard to predict

Protestors outside an earlier meeting make their views clear. Protestors outside an earlier meeting make their views clear.

Friday, April 4, 2014
9:47 AM

While the arguments for cancelling the contract now look overwhelming, the actual vote is a much tougher one to call.

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In October, Norfolk County Council voted by 40 votes to 38 to press ahead with the incinerator.

While many hope Monday will see the project scrapped and contract to build and run it with Cory Wheelabrator terminated, the margin remains hard to predict. We e-mailed every county councillor to ask them how they would be voting. Some 19 - just under a quarter - replied.

The Conservatives, who championed the incinerator while they were in power, now control less than half of the seats on the 84-strong council.

They remain the largest group, with 40 seats, but are outnumbered collectively by Labour (14 seats), UKIP (13), the LibDems (10), Greens (4) and Independents (2); making a total of 43.

The council also currently has one non-aligned member, former UKIP councillor Matthew Smith, who has been suspended by his party.

UKIP, the LibDems, Greens, Independents will almost certainly vote to scrap the burner. Labour look set to follow suit, with members in cabinet roles no longer supporting it. That makes 43 votes against, which might look like game over.

Less clear is how the Conservatives will vote. Long-standing opponents Brian Long and John Dobson on the Conservatives will vote to scrap it. Jason Law and Martin Storey, who also voted against the incinerator last time, will presumably do so again.

Bill Borrett, Harry Humphrey, Ian Mackie and Alison Thomas were all members of the cabinet who agreed the original contract. But like most, they were giving nothing away prior to the meeting.

Then there is the question of abstentions or absences - just one or two could make matters very close indeed. Six were absent from October’s vote, meaning it could, in theory, have gone the other way.

But even if the full council does not vote to cancel the contract, the cabinet could still do so.

48 comments

  • No. Got him. Deffo Sailor Bill. That's who he has stuck in that dormant organ. He does know the chap could not string two sentences together doesn't he ? I mean someone has told him surely ? Perhaps not.

    Report this comment

    Del Boy

    Sunday, April 6, 2014

  • Well done CB. That`s flushed the Pheasant out. He had almost stopped posting and so I was getting concerned as to his health. D, didn`t someone on this forum state that politics is a dirty business? This person was only referring to County Council level whilst the real decisions were being made at a higher level. Come on, tell me that this is anti-democratic.

    Report this comment

    democrat

    Sunday, April 6, 2014

  • Bill, Ben, Geoff, Vikings and hockey teams....Have these campaigners completely lost the plot ? The main thing is that the 'vote' goes according to plan and they continue with the project as they rightly should.

    Report this comment

    Mr A. Schicklgruber

    Sunday, April 6, 2014

  • Instead of an incinerator can we build a wall around kings lynn and just chuck the rubbish over the wall.

    Report this comment

    Steady On

    Friday, April 4, 2014

  • Pheasant plucker. At an additional cost of four hundred thousand pounds per month? That is almost half a million pounds being robbed from public services! At an additional risk of five million more if Mr Pickles says no or if cw lose their financial backers or if cw decide to give up and go elsewhere. You do know that cory environmental are in debt to the tune of two hundred and eighty million dont you?

    Report this comment

    Canary Boy

    Saturday, April 5, 2014

  • As CB says, your comments (however flawed) were sent from yet another fictitious email address. If you had true courage, you'd have used your real name and address, wouldn't you Bill?

    Report this comment

    User Removed

    Sunday, April 6, 2014

  • Canary Boy, surely not the same Roger Smith who said: “What is the point of being a councillor if you don’t have an open mind and the ability to listen to others.”

    Report this comment

    Honest John

    Saturday, April 5, 2014

  • An earlier comment was; "As CB says, your comments (however flawed) were sent from yet another fictitious email address. If you had true courage, you'd have used your real name and address, wouldn't you Bill?" - The thing about that statement is that either all email addresses are accepted as fiction or they are all fact due to their very nature in the same way that blog names are. We are all the same and one cannot single any one person out without painting themselves with the same brush.

    Report this comment

    Jim Hacker

    Sunday, April 6, 2014

  • If councillors won't turn up or vote one way or another they should stand down. I am lost for words when it comes to Billy Borret and co, I fail to see how there positions are tenable as they have made a pigs ear of everything by signing dodgy contracts

    Report this comment

    Sweet cheeks

    Friday, April 4, 2014

  • Get on and build it. Stand up for democracy and not the whining minority of NIMBY's. It's got to go somewhere and the Willows Site is as good a site as any.

    Report this comment

    Andy T

    Friday, April 4, 2014

  • Get on and build it. Stand up for democracy and not the whining minority of NIMBY's. It's got to go somewhere and the Willows Site is as good a site as any.

    Report this comment

    Andy T

    Friday, April 4, 2014

  • A little bird has just given me some very interesting info. Apparently Borrett is wealding his wh.ip over all but the NW Norfolk members to vote to continue with the incinerator!! Cllr Roger Smith, accountant extrodinaire, will give a presentation with overhead displays etc which will prove that the officers employed by us are indeed incom.petent. Borrett had always claimed the officers were the ultimate professionals who we must trust to always be right! That was until they admitted to carry on with the incinerator was no longer financially viable but expo.ses Norfolk to unacceptable r.isk. If the Tories continue on this path, now the figures are at last in the public domain, they stand to lose more than 20 odd seats at the next election! Does anyone know if Paul Borrett is related to old Bill?

    Report this comment

    Canary Boy

    Friday, April 4, 2014

  • Well, I'm certainly keeping you on your toes today aren't I Bill? I make it six different 'oh so witty' usernames you've used just today so far - glad to see you're spending the whole weekend rattled.

    Report this comment

    User Removed

    Sunday, April 6, 2014

  • Cllr. Roger Smith lost 1000 votes at his last election, and he has done very little to advice against the 4 million spent on the wrong advice from consutants, so his last minute number crunching, the Tory's last call to manipulate the democratic vote, will hopefully be answered by cllr.s deserved derision. Whipping Cllr.s along party lines and telling them not to turn up is manipulation of the worst kind. Norfolk deserves a comprehensive solution to its waste problems, something that could be provided by a British made cheaper solution, so lets not fail Norfolk any longer.

    Report this comment

    ingo wagenknecht

    Saturday, April 5, 2014

  • These incinerators are good value. No point in changing now anyway. These campaigners like to have all the say don't they ? Dictators more like.

    Report this comment

    Richard The Third

    Sunday, April 6, 2014

  • You might call such people 'computer buffs'. I would call them 'criminals'. As would the law enforcement agencies you have alluded to. Back to Google with you.

    Report this comment

    User Removed

    Sunday, April 6, 2014

  • Don`t know what I shall do with my spare time after the incinerator project is kicked out, as it must surely be now. They might as well because Mr Pickles will otherwise. Think I`ll look out for D on the forums, in order to see who he pretends to be on that particular day, and probably to oppose his views.

    Report this comment

    democrat

    Sunday, April 6, 2014

  • I wonder Can.ary would BB be daft enough to 'whip' the Tories and risk his political future in the ensuing witch-hunt. It is possible that people have information that could be revealed if this happens. Will he take that risk? Will any of them take that risk?

    Report this comment

    Sandy.L

    Saturday, April 5, 2014

  • Well said Canary Boy, there are quite a lot of Conservative councillors who need to earn their respect back, and a vote to stop this on Monday will go a good way to doing that. Mic.kleborough and Lan.gwade are two who did not believe their refusal to change would cost them dearly, and look what happened to them, staunch Conservatives voted for Labour and UKIP. I can see a big shock coming in the general election across Norfolk if Conservative Councillors vote to continue to destroy our county on Monday, then Borrett really will be hung out to dry!

    Report this comment

    Honest John

    Saturday, April 5, 2014

  • That comment is a wretched attempt to sound as if you know what you're talking about whereas I would suggest that you are just resorting to stringing various sound-bites together in an effort to sound credible. I am very aware of what can be done by various agencies on-line but, alas for you, I'm not intimidated by anything you have to say on the subject. Happy blogging to you too.

    Report this comment

    User Removed

    Sunday, April 6, 2014

  • I was talking to Di.ckens! Dont tell the plucker is yet another poster name set up via mail.com.

    Report this comment

    Canary Boy

    Sunday, April 6, 2014

  • Judging by the last 20 or so comments, quite a few Sherry bottles must have been consumed by our multi-user name commentators on Sunday. Are the rest of us supposed to understand what they're on about or is it a private conversation?

    Report this comment

    Sugarbeet

    Monday, April 7, 2014

  • HJ, one and the same. We all have a soft spot for the obnoxious chair of the planning regulator committee who made sure that no representatives west of Dereham sat on that committee on 29th June 2012. The same chair who was rude, agg.resive and biased against speakers against the proposal. Remember his argument with Henry and shouting at Judi Knights, the very well educated quietly spoken lady who he reduced to tears! Undoubtedly Borrett will claim his members are not under the whip - to be fair NW Norfolk ones are not - but I am sure the record I will take of the vote will prove the conservative group vote as one. After reading the reports no sane person could possibly dissagree with the officer recommendation.

    Report this comment

    Canary Boy

    Saturday, April 5, 2014

  • Some of the comments posted here are indicative of the level of intellect of many of the incinerator supporters. These comments add nothing to the debate and are posted merely to insult. I am surprised that this publication continues to give a platform for those that express such inflamatory drivel.

    Report this comment

    mrsmurphy

    Friday, April 4, 2014

  • One hopes that a decision in favour will be Monday's result. Incinerators are wonders to behold and every County should have one. Very cleansing.

    Report this comment

    Right Reverend Fuller

    Sunday, April 6, 2014

  • If you lack the basic intelligence to read what's in front of you then just ignore it and go back to sleep dear.

    Report this comment

    User Removed

    Tuesday, April 8, 2014

  • I don't think he means Borratt. It could be Dawes. He has a mate called 'Geoff'. He thought I was him last month. Ignore it and it might go away. Tell him you don't drink at the Downham Con Club either. Bloke is obsessed.

    Report this comment

    Del Boy

    Sunday, April 6, 2014

  • Some of the comments posted here are indicative of the level of intellect of many of the incinerator supporters. These comments add nothing to the debate and are posted merely to insult. I am surprised that this publication continues to give a platform for those that express such inflamatory drivel.

    Report this comment

    mrsmurphy

    Friday, April 4, 2014

  • You appear to be the only person who's not a member of the biggest hockey team in the world... over 65,000 members and rising. Poor you.

    Report this comment

    User Removed

    Sunday, April 6, 2014

  • I wonder how many of the anti's who claimed the officers mislead the councillors by saying the project was above board etc are now praising the same officers now that the officers' opinion gives them what they wanted.

    Report this comment

    G_of_Norwich

    Saturday, April 5, 2014

  • PS. Any councillor who has read the reports to both full council and cabinet must realise the project must end prior to 1st May. For Borrett, and his inner circle, to ignore what has been spelt out by officers, who have previously used every underhand tactic possible to bulldozer the incinerator through, must raise the question of if certain cllrs have a vested, personal interest in this project continuing. Why else would they now take a line against their supposedly expert officers who they have previously insisted were highly professional and always work towards the best possible outcome for Norfolk? Those same officers now say the contract should be termimated it is only Borrett and his inner group who say whatever the cost or consequences the CW contract must continue.

    Report this comment

    Canary Boy

    Saturday, April 5, 2014

  • I think we can be certain that anyone who wants to vote in favour of scra.pping the incinerator on Monday, going against the wishes of a leader who has an interest for it to continue, will be told to stay away. Let us hope these councillors will turn up and vote regardless of party whi.pping, in the knowledge that it is easier to elect a new and respected leader, and live a life knowing they have honoured their own con.science, than live with regret for the rest of their lives.

    Report this comment

    Honest John

    Saturday, April 5, 2014

  • G.of.Norwich. Doubtful that any of them would trust the officers! Weren't they the ones who went over to the USA to check out CW and ignored the violations the company had there.

    Report this comment

    Sandy.L

    Saturday, April 5, 2014

  • Any social media logs onto a main suite database of information held including the basics. Without realising it over a period of years people have used their Pcs to give everything from banking, credit card details, shopping, names, addresses, telephone numbers, emails, date of birth, payment info and thousands of other pieces of information about themselves. All of it is stored. From there you can interlog through coded platforms and upload information about driving licence, passport, medical and much more. It is even possible to reverse look back into a webcam and see who is sitting there. This is how the Police, Law Enforcement Agencies and Government Departments do their thing when they need to. Scary stuff. Happy blogging.

    Report this comment

    Jim Hacker

    Sunday, April 6, 2014

  • No, but he's definitely a friend of Geoff....

    Report this comment

    User Removed

    Sunday, April 6, 2014

  • Multi name Fen strikes again.....pray tell who is this 'Bill' ? You and your other names keep mentioning him. Is he a friend of 'Ben' ?

    Report this comment

    Pugh Bickley

    Sunday, April 6, 2014

  • Is Bill or is Geoff hoping to become a Viking? Now there's a question.

    Report this comment

    Sandy.L

    Sunday, April 6, 2014

  • Steady On we could always build it at Norwich where is was going in the first place. Or how about at County Hall with the rest of the rubbish

    Report this comment

    Sweet cheeks

    Friday, April 4, 2014

  • Who is this canary chirping on about and who sent an email to who and how would he know anyway? Who told him ? He seems fond of information so let's have some. More detail or more quiet please or you sound like just another gust of wind on here.

    Report this comment

    Not A Pheasant Plucker

    Sunday, April 6, 2014

  • You keep believing that if it makes you feel better. Doesn't change the facts to hand, does it?

    Report this comment

    User Removed

    Sunday, April 6, 2014

  • A computer specialist can view the same screen as the moderation team and by using the same codes it is possible to remotely reject and remove users from the system. It also allows access to all the IP addresses on their systems and historical comments can be removed, altered and blocked. It is a specialist field used by some computer buffs who alter other peoples online comments or remove them. You can also block and unblock accounts or rename and re launch them remotely.

    Report this comment

    Jim Hacker

    Sunday, April 6, 2014

  • So what is the big deal with this incinerator already? So soon and they are complaining? Some people you give them good cloth and they still look at the seams. Sounds like a good investment to me.

    Report this comment

    Solomon Cohen

    Sunday, April 6, 2014

  • I do not see anything hard to predict. Obviously they must vote in favour of keeping the project or they have wasted the money and time and will still have the same problem. Any sensible council would vote to keep the incinerator and wait for the Sec of States approval.

    Report this comment

    Not A Pheasant Plucker

    Saturday, April 5, 2014

  • G, I dont trust the officers as far as I can throw them but they have had to finally admit, because they can no longer cross their fingers and hope the truth will remain hidden, that to continue is financial suicide for norfolks public purse and public services. There is nowhere to hide anymore! The cllrs BB has told to stay away if they wont do as they have been told should do exactly that if they dont have the courage, dignity or conscience to vote for the good of public services. They should take a leaf out of Alex Kemps book she earned great respect county wide for outing the bu.llying labour wh.ip.

    Report this comment

    Canary Boy

    Saturday, April 5, 2014

  • Don't forget the final decision is down to the cabinet, so not a Tory in sight. Regardless of what full council say, I can't see GNobbs going against the officers recommendation.

    Report this comment

    Bikerboy

    Saturday, April 5, 2014

  • Steady On, that was exactly the plan anyway. Dump it all in King`s Lynn and then burn it (that which will burn). No pollution of course and apparently a tourist attraction. You couldn`t make it up!

    Report this comment

    democrat

    Friday, April 4, 2014

  • What's with all the name calling already ? All your lives you get nothing and you still want more? The plans look very good to me and what a bargain at twice the price. Very good business.

    Report this comment

    Solomon Cohen

    Sunday, April 6, 2014

  • Bill or Ben? More like the Little Weed. Bet this gets removed.

    Report this comment

    democrat

    Sunday, April 6, 2014

The views expressed in the above comments do not necessarily reflect the views of this site

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