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 07/11/2009, 3:37 PM
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mahatma kane jeeves
 
Joined on 14/03/2007
Posts 1,618
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My final comment.
Why have we heard nothing from the police about this verdict ? I would like to know what the investigating officers think about it , have they been told to keep their opinions quiet ? They had plenty to say after the Frank Mcgarahan sentence ( how the two brothers who beat him to death must wish they had been in the army )
And the relatives of the victim , i`m sure they have plenty to say but the EDP clearly has not bothered to ask them. Why not ? I hope they go to the court of appeal and the attorney general to report an unduly lenient sentence.
And just to remind you Richard , Gooda admitted punching the victim to the ground , said he did not regret it and would do it again.
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07/11/2009, 4:26 PM
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wallis
Joined on 10/07/2008
Posts 5,237
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![Indifferent [:|]](/CS/emoticons/emotion-8.gif)
Re: Prince Of Wales Road
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MaCoat
seconded
over and ite
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07/11/2009, 4:32 PM
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Richard
Joined on 08/01/2004
Posts 274
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Oh well I tried, some people just cannot see the woods for the trees.
Live your Dream Ask me how?
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07/11/2009, 4:48 PM
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Kizzy
Joined on 13/05/2007
Posts 341
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 Richard wrote: |
| Kizzy wrote: | | He also kicked a policeman when he was arrested. Let's hope another soldier in Afghanistan doesn't bear the brunt of his anger. |
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Naughty boy kicking a policeman. Think the other squaddies will know how to handle him.
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Is that supposed to be funny Richard? It is just childish as was the behaviour of Gooda.
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07/11/2009, 5:14 PM
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wallis
Joined on 10/07/2008
Posts 5,237
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Re: Prince Of Wales Road
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Richard
you are right, of course
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07/11/2009, 5:46 PM
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Richard
Joined on 08/01/2004
Posts 274
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| Kizzy wrote: | | Richard wrote: |
| Kizzy wrote: | | He also kicked a policeman when he was arrested. Let's hope another soldier in Afghanistan doesn't bear the brunt of his anger. |
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Naughty boy kicking a policeman. Think the other squaddies will know how to handle him.
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Is that supposed to be funny Richard? It is just childish as was the behaviour of Gooda.
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No Kissy it was not supposed to be funny, but I thought your comment was, (He also kicked a policeman when he was arrested.) I just imagined a big burly policeman fighting off a little five year old boy trying to kick him.
Please explain how you come to the conclusion that Gooda's behaviour was childish.
It is a serious matter when a chap hs been cleared of manslaughter and still people are still saying that he is guilty.
And that a judge and jury don't know their jobs.
Live your Dream Ask me how?
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10/11/2009, 11:05 AM
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mahatma kane jeeves
Joined on 14/03/2007
Posts 1,618
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http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/norfolk/8351842.stm
Well what do you expect ? , a few days after one violent , drunken lout walks free.
Unless all people convicted of violent , drunken behaviour in Norwich know that they will got to prison for several years at least ( regardless of occupation ) it will continue.
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10/11/2009, 12:50 PM
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Baconsdozen.
Joined on 02/09/2003
Lowestoft
Posts 1,702
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| mahatma kane jeeves wrote: | http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/norfolk/8351842.stm
Well what do you expect ? , a few days after one violent , drunken lout walks free.
Unless all people convicted of violent , drunken behaviour in Norwich know that they will got to prison for several years at least ( regardless of occupation ) it will continue.
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Absolutely right.When are all these ruddy do gooders going to wake up to the fact that their sofly softly catchee bugger all policies have left us in a lawless state?.
(Probably a couple of nano seconds after some yobs pulverise them for the want of something better to do on a saturday night).
WDC and its caravan site.
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11/11/2009, 6:19 PM
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wallis
Joined on 10/07/2008
Posts 5,237
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Re: Prince Of Wales Road
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MaCoat
the best uniform for guaranteeing immunity from prosecution is the TSG one... complete with balaclava and no ID shoulder tabs
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12/11/2009, 12:17 AM
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Richard
Joined on 08/01/2004
Posts 274
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| mahatma kane jeeves wrote: | http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/norfolk/8351842.stm
Well what do you expect ? , a few days after one violent , drunken lout walks free.
Unless all people convicted of violent , drunken behaviour in Norwich know that they will got to prison for several years at least ( regardless of occupation ) it will continue.
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Mkj. If you are referring to the Gooda case. He was given 28wks suspended sentence for causing an affray.
Why do you have to keep referring to this case when there are worse ones, ie the Frank Mcgarahan case where two brothers beat him to death. (as you have quoted previous)
Whatever sentence you give these people after the event, even if they know they will get years in prison, it will not make any differance to their behaviour.
I have no real answer to this problem, perhaps a ruling should be brought in that the bouncers should check people coming out of these clubs and any one found to be agressive noisy or completely out of their heads, and not able to go home in an orderly fashion, then they should be arrested and jailed for a month, either solitary confinement or hard labour.
Live your Dream Ask me how?
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12/11/2009, 9:30 AM
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nevermind
Joined on 28/05/2007
Posts 3,173
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who is responsible for the actions of a drunken oik trying to get another drink in a pub? Is it the bar staff and bouncers who are not drunk and should turn drunk people away? or is it the inebriated youngsters who not only lost his toilet training during the night revelleries, but has also lost his ability to remember his name due to being foru times over the limit?
If clubs are supposed to control and police drunken youngsters, as it seems to be the drift, then how can we expect a drunken offender to be wholly in charge of a situation?
Although not in this case, it happens as a norm that clubs are not held responsible. If someone get hit or dies due to the actions of club staff, then the club should be shut whilst this case is scrutinised, why can they carry on operating with impunity?
This dicotomy is not being dealt with, and hence my opposition to self policing and arbitrary justice dished out by bouncers.
I understand that magistrates are also not sure about this newly thought way of policing clubland.
I wonder what lector would say to these frequently returning scenario's? nevermind
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12/11/2009, 9:52 AM
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thelibrarian
Joined on 27/08/2009
Posts 392
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The country has gone stupid and money rules. Half of the kids collapsing drunk on pavements at three in the morning are probably falling asleep as much as intoxicated. I wonder how many working hours are lost because of the club culture of not starting the evening until gone 10 pm and then not winding up until 5 in the morning.When did that start? I find it quite absurd that there are kids standing at bus stops at 10.30pm on their way into town to go clubbing when even in the 70s the night would have been considered half over by then.
If as many police hours were lost policing raves as they are policing the customers of clubs and bars which wilfully continue to serve to the obviously drunk then we as council tax payers would make a huge fuss
I thought it was the duty of the police to report to the licencing authorities those establishments which persist in keeping a disorderly house. Relying on a private army of bouncers is not satisfactory. Licences should be revoked and the whole structure of " clubland" all over the country should be examined. I am all for having fun and even a skinful but it is my belief that the pockets of the club and pub owners are lined at the expense of the rest of us. I bet if it was an independently owned pub in a village spewing out riotously drunk bikers or metal heads at three am there would soon be some action from the magistrates, but because big business is behind the places in the city they sit like mice in silence.
It is patently absurd that the Norfolk County Council has to find the money to fund policing of the club zones but it cannot find the money to pay for sixth form and FE students to get to college to be educated.
Changing licencing laws looked as if it would be a good thing but in practice it has not worked and we need to get a grip on who is running our town and city centres- us or brewery and club owners.
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12/11/2009, 10:26 AM
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Scaramouche
Joined on 02/04/2006
obscure
Posts 1,935
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| thelibrarian wrote: | The country has gone stupid and money rules. Half of the kids collapsing drunk on pavements at three in the morning are probably falling asleep as much as intoxicated. I wonder how many working hours are lost because of the club culture of not starting the evening until gone 10 pm and then not winding up until 5 in the morning.When did that start? I find it quite absurd that there are kids standing at bus stops at 10.30pm on their way into town to go clubbing when even in the 70s the night would have been considered half over by then.
If as many police hours were lost policing raves as they are policing the customers of clubs and bars which wilfully continue to serve to the obviously drunk then we as council tax payers would make a huge fuss
I thought it was the duty of the police to report to the licencing authorities those establishments which persist in keeping a disorderly house. Relying on a private army of bouncers is not satisfactory. Licences should be revoked and the whole structure of " clubland" all over the country should be examined. I am all for having fun and even a skinful but it is my belief that the pockets of the club and pub owners are lined at the expense of the rest of us. I bet if it was an independently owned pub in a village spewing out riotously drunk bikers or metal heads at three am there would soon be some action from the magistrates, but because big business is behind the places in the city they sit like mice in silence.
It is patently absurd that the Norfolk County Council has to find the money to fund policing of the club zones but it cannot find the money to pay for sixth form and FE students to get to college to be educated.
Changing licencing laws looked as if it would be a good thing but in practice it has not worked and we need to get a grip on who is running our town and city centres- us or brewery and club owners.
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Broadly - in agreement.
Now that smoking has been tackled, alcohol in Britain and throughout
the Western world is the next biggest socio-economic and health
threat. Truth to be told it was always the biggest, just as in 1914
when its growth pattern in Britain resulted in the introduction of pub
closing times, in a bid to deny all day drinking. Boozing most of the night is no
less damaging than drinking your days away.
That reintroduction is now overdue, and may be the only way to limit the present
drink 'till you chuck habits of a whole generation of clubbers. Of
course, there's a tendency for older drinkers to dismiss these
off-the-face pursuits as indicative that our successors just can't cope
with the 'ard stuff like wot we could. Whereas in reality, we simply
never had to deal with the sheer levels of peer pressure, advertising,
commercial exploitation and availability, which todays' youngsters have thrown at them.
Society's agents, in the form of government needs to take action soon. On
the evidence of Norwich alone, it can't
be left to local authorities, and it certainly can't be left to the police.
And the bonus? Such action not only stops the wrecking crews; it also allows us to reclaim the lost streets of once proud and pleasant cities.
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12/11/2009, 10:59 AM
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thelibrarian
Joined on 27/08/2009
Posts 392
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I am entirely in agreement with you , especially on the what we did and the pressure from all sides that kids face at the moment.It is all pervasive and watching ad men on TV admit that their focus is on preteens and teenagers- once they can hook them they are theirs for life they reckon- is completely scary. I really cannot recall my school days and youth being dominated by brand names and image and the notion that to not conform is to be an outcast. I blame it on exposing kids to peer group pressure at too early an age in nurseries and child minding facilities
I suppose most of us have done some pavement climbing in our time, but perhaps being middle class back then kept us with one brain cell on the consequences of a d&d conviction, maybe only the rich/posh had no fear of being sent down.I might be wrong, but seems to me if you went in pubs in the late 60s early 70s, there were not the working class "live at home" young people there in any great numbers in the way that they form the client base of the clubs now. Obviously they patronised all the "discos" and clubs of the era, but those, we know, were far fewer than they are today.
One for the sociologists.
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18/11/2009, 8:46 PM
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based on Facts
Joined on 18/11/2009
Posts 1
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It's interesting 'jeeves' that you assume Gooda was the drunken violent lout in the event. Are you aware that toxicology reports showed that it was in fact the deceased who was over 2 times the drink - drive limit and that he had traces of cocaine in his blood?? The toxicology report indicates there was no trace of even alcohol in Gooda's system, never mind anything else.
Doesn't that throw a spanner into your 'drunken soldier out of control' theory?
Did you also know that CCTV footage shows Gooda asking the bouncer to intervene whilst the now deceased was head-butting and punching his friend? and it was only after the bouncer did nothing that he stepped in?
Did you also know that the boys in question were leaving the premises quietly even after being antagonised and it was in fact the now deceased who called them back and attacked them?
Well, you probably didn't know any of these things... not to mention any of the other facts, because you are basing your opinions on the small amount of information (not evidence) given by the reporters who attended not even half of the trial - and filling in the rest with presumptions of your own. Unfortunately, this case is a huge tragedy and it is only natural the dead must be glorified and the other blamed. The facts however show that it was not this clear cut, and the judge and jury have clearly been given all the facts - unlike you.
I share Richard's concern for your treating Gooda as if he was still guilty. Why? because you think he is? based on what? the perception some journalist gave you from the EDP? The justice system may not be perfect but it does a far better job than the local paper and some bored over opinionated spectator.
Richard, you suggest that bouncers should check people coming in and out of clubs these days - well, some do. Moore (the deceased in the Gooda case), despite having been drinking heavily, was allowed to stay because he was 'friends with the manager'. The man who Gooda was found guilty for affray against was this 'friend'. Funny how Gooda punched Moore twice (not 3 by the way, only 2 connected) defending his friend and was then repeatedly punched and attacked by the manager who was only defending his friend. Between the two, who was right? According to the law the manager who had allowed his overly drunk friend to stay in the club, where any other normal person would have been kicked out. Who later started a fight with youths half his age for something that had nothing to do with him and no need for fighting about it.
So you’re right, something does need to be done about excessive drinking. In this case had Moore not been so intoxicated he might not have felt so confident to begin a fight for no reason. If he had not been so drunk he would probably not have fallen to the floor like a lead weight without sticking his hands out to stop his fall, like any sober person would do, which was the actual cause of death.
Don't get me wrong - this isn't not a tragedy for one second but it's not a clear cut case of brutal attacker and unsuspecting victim. The law has clearly shown this.
I totally agree that there is a drink problem in Britain. i know many people that have been caught up in a fight that wasn't theirs i.e. just punched for no reason - should these people that are just having a good time be locked up in prison for several years because of the actions of another too jeeves? and if we see a friend being attacked by some drunk - should we not defend them if we know how to, incase something bad happens? Well, what if by worrying that something bad will happen to ourselves, we then let something bad happen to a friend? What's your answer to that? jail all round?
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EDP24 Forums » EDP24 General » News » Prince Of Wales Road
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